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Acceleration problems (RaceChip edition)

This is a discussion on Acceleration problems (RaceChip edition) within the Kia Forte Turbo Performance forums, part of the Kia Forte Turbo Garage category; Did you update Torque with your elevation? Might not make that big of a difference but 20 is high for stock. Do you do any ...

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Thread: Acceleration problems (RaceChip edition)

  1. #11
    Senior Member lephoenix's Avatar
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    Did you update Torque with your elevation? Might not make that big of a difference but 20 is high for stock.

    Do you do any of the work on your car yourself? If not, no shame. But you can do the MAP sensor very easily. It's just a plug and 2 screws and is right on the front of the engine.

  2. #12
    PLP
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    So basically with everything said here, for the price of GTS one can get a more or less real tune.
    Sure, it is more permanent, unless you get a spare ECU... which then increases the overall cost.

    The sputtering - that is exactly what I had when the boost got limited. It would run rough at idle, almost like dying, but after a few seconds it would recover and start going smoothly again.
    As for the boost limit. Happened a few times that even when it was running smooth, it would still need a restart. And once, just once, the restart did not help until the engine cooled off.

    Per boost.
    I was using mechanical gauge on both. I check its calibration in the lab (at work) and it was almost spot on. Almost means I would be off by a fraction of psi.

    So, during the idle sputtering boost would be jumping back and forth. From about -10 in Hg to +5 psi. When settled, it would be at -17 to -15 in Hg.
    When driving - both when stock showed same results - +15 psi sustained with around 18 psi peak that would take place anywhere from 2000 to 3500 rpm. Above 4000 rpm it would start tapering off towards 12 psi or so.
    Weirdly, octane rating did not really make much of a difference.

    Then, with the tune, I was shooting about 23 psi, sustained 21 psi. It was a drastic improvement. I just loved how it drove.
    Now, driving wife's Q5 that is 2.0T - I must say Forte did NOT have any turbo lag. In Audi, the power comes, you can feel it, and then it stays with you even past 80 mph. However, in KIA you could feel like it was almost hitting you. WOT in 3rd and you could feel relatively quick power buildup and strong pull. While OEM was getting weak past 70 mph, with the tune - 90 mph and was still pulling like crazy.

    There are days I miss the car
    But then EV makes me smile each day from being quiet and as quick as tuned F5 (up until about 40 mph), not to mention power delivery on demand.


    Oh, one more thing.
    I believe 22 psi is the max the OEM MAP can read, hence you might not get more than that from Torque.
    Get a mechanical gauge which is much faster in response and much more reliable.
    Drives:
    2016 KIA Forte5 SX 1.6 T-GDI, A/T ("cheap GTI" - surprises many drivers) - SOLD... Some OEM and aftermarket parts left after... see my FS thread in market section.
    2014 FIAT 500e (my first EV - awesome toy!!)
    2015 AUDI Q5 (for wife...)
    2016 FIAT 500X Trekking Plus AWD with Roof and Beats (for wife)

  3. #13
    Senior Member lephoenix's Avatar
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    GTS - $500 48hp/85tq
    Sxth OEM+ (with rental flashing equipment) - $424 10-15hp/16tq

    The most basic Racechip S is $279 and claims 32hp/56tq at the crank. Maybe about 24hp 42 tq at the wheels in an auto.

    Of course, you're missing a lot of features that the tune would have but you're getting more claimed power for cheaper and its removable. But, it's not an apples to apples comparison.

    The rest of your post is very interesting, I don't have anything to add to it though. Maybe only that I want more boost. lol

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    PLP
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    Quote Originally Posted by lephoenix View Post
    GTS - $500 48hp/85tq
    Frankly, I highly doubt it... there is nothing on their page supporting this statement.

    Quote Originally Posted by lephoenix View Post
    Sxth OEM+ (with rental flashing equipment) - $424 10-15hp/16tq
    If stock is say 200 and Sxth added only 15, then it felt much more. Car felt like it had about 30% more power in lower gears (actually grip limited).
    The biggest difference was in the higher speeds. Was unstoppable.


    Going back on track.
    Adding 50 HP and 85 lb*ft takes a bit more than some cheat. Especially when you are talking about adding more than 40% of torque.
    Even Sxth does not claim that with stock internals. For bolt on it claims extra 45 torque and 40 power... so I would be very careful in believing GTS can add 85 torque on a stock car. Especially for our (well, not mine anymore ) 1.6T. If it was VW 2.0, I could believe it.
    Drives:
    2016 KIA Forte5 SX 1.6 T-GDI, A/T ("cheap GTI" - surprises many drivers) - SOLD... Some OEM and aftermarket parts left after... see my FS thread in market section.
    2014 FIAT 500e (my first EV - awesome toy!!)
    2015 AUDI Q5 (for wife...)
    2016 FIAT 500X Trekking Plus AWD with Roof and Beats (for wife)

  6. #15
    Senior Member lephoenix's Avatar
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    Ha. Yeah they say up to that amount so I don't know. But, there's a lot of praise from users on other platforms, including Hyundai/Kia owners. Their are also plenty of dyno's from guys running these on Stingers and Optimas plus other makes, Honda, BMW, Merc, etc

    Consider this, a rough way to estimate the power of 1 additional psi of boost is plus 7% output of the motor in naturally aspirated form. Since we make about 200 hp at about 16 psi our naturally aspirated power should be around 95 hp.
    ((95 hp *0.07)*16)+95 hp=201.4 hp
    So we're in the same ballpark. 95*0.07 = 6.65 this is about how much crank horsepower we could get from 1 additional psi.
    6.65hp * 4 psi (the amount their sales/support guy claimed) = 26.6 hp which would only result in about half of what they claim. But, I have some doubts about the 4psi. LAP3 uncle chip has reportedly added up to 7 psi.
    6.65 * 7psi = 46.55 hp
    This seems to match up a little better with their claims.

    We can also make assumptions about peak horsepower remaining at near the stock rpm range and torque peaking far lower...

    Anyway, that is all to say, by adding 7 psi they could maybe hit those numbers. Not sure how they could do it with less psi. But even adding 2-3 psi would probably result in 12-15 whp and 20-25 wtq. That would definitely be noticeable.
    These piggybacks are really just smart boost controllers.

    Regarding Sxth, they just hit the lower 300s wtq on stock internals the other day. Durability? Probably limited. But it's possible.
    And I'm not doubting their tune. I would love to get one someday. It is MUCH more comprehensive than these piggybacks. Even without touching boost they are making solid gains. I don't think the current OEM+ tune modifies boost levels. Since Sxth posts numbers at the wheels we can assume about 20 crank hp and 20 crank tq. Which would be a safer way to achieve the same numbers as 2-3 extra psi plus having throttle input made a bit more aggressive among other things.

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    RaceChip is definitely just playing with the boost. To the point where they actually only make RaceChip units for cars with a stock turbo in it. Also, I figured that the car going into limp mode WAS from actually just pretty much getting more psi than what is allowed, which may actually give other products like LAP3 an edge since those are probably made for those kind of limitations in mind. Either way, lemme contact RaceChip and see if they have a way around this.

  8. #17
    Senior Member lephoenix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenletters View Post
    Yeah, they offered to send the correct cables out but they said it may take a while since it took almost a month for the unit to come in the first place since they have a pretty hefty backorder right now (XLR is very popular right now). Honestly though, your comment on the aesthetics has convinced me to go down the XLR route instead, may as well not give up one them yet because SB V3, even though it has way more settings than you'll ever need, just looks plain ugly. Also, thanks for all the tips, next time I amass enough items to shove into the car, I'll remember to ask for all these to be done since the car is still running fine right now and I'm at a point where I'd like to put in multiple things at once (For example, I'll probably get the MAP sensor, new Brake lines, Strut bar, and Fuel lines).

    And that 22+ was with the chip. I have the gauge on Torque that's basically 2 half circles, one for vacuum and the other for boost and they both meet their apex at the top at 22. I've only ever hit 20 at stock so hitting 22 just tells me that I most likely went over it. I'll take a screen of it later but either way, it just means I need to relearn my car's parameters for the time being.
    Any update on your XLR order?

    Also, any update on a Racechip review?

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    I returned the XLR. I'll probably end up reordering another one at a later date but right now, I'm gonna learn more about the GTS. I'm probably not going to have a review ready for a while (I think I'll wait for after I get another XLR) . I'm debating on either doing that or just making 2 separate reviews about it but I still need to try the rest of the settings on the chip. I just finished figuring out my engine sputtering and it becomes less or more pronounced depending on what octane of fuel I have in the car (I now just use Mid-Grade/89) and also, the engine/exhaust does pops and crackles on harder acceleration. RaceChip kinda makes this a mystery box as well since the manual they give you is vague when it comes to which settings do what but regardless, I just need to find a god spot/time to give the chip a good thorough testing.

  10. #19
    PLP
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    So maybe get a good quality tune before the engine gets damaged...

    It is simple to allow more air to be pumped in, but results of this game can be fatal.
    Drives:
    2016 KIA Forte5 SX 1.6 T-GDI, A/T ("cheap GTI" - surprises many drivers) - SOLD... Some OEM and aftermarket parts left after... see my FS thread in market section.
    2014 FIAT 500e (my first EV - awesome toy!!)
    2015 AUDI Q5 (for wife...)
    2016 FIAT 500X Trekking Plus AWD with Roof and Beats (for wife)

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    Quote Originally Posted by PLP View Post
    So maybe get a good quality tune before the engine gets damaged...

    It is simple to allow more air to be pumped in, but results of this game can be fatal.
    Yeah but I'm going to test the other settings for maybe a week each. For all we know, and because RaceChip is pretty radio silent as well, the other settings may actually tackle it differently.

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